Nördlingen 1634

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chema1986
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Nördlingen 1634

Post by chema1986 » Tue May 06, 2014 11:03 am

Hello Gentlemen, I would like to ask you, specially those experts in Swedish matters... some questions about the Protestant order of battle...
- Did the Swedish Blue regiment participated in battle ? and Did it carry their old flags from Lutzen and Breitenfeld ?

- Does anybody know any flag for the German (Saxon? ) Regiments of Bernard Von Saxe-Weimar ? I have seen some flags on "Battle Flag"
http://www.battle-flag.com/25mm28mm-swe ... flags.html

are those valid for Nördlingen ?

- Did the Swedish current national flag exist at that time ? I want to make a command base with Marshall Gustav Horn and add a Swedish Flag, but I don't know what flag to use...

- May I use in my army a unit of Finnish "Hackapell" or whatever is written :lol: cavalry ??

Thank you very much!

Cheers.
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Friedrich August I.
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by Friedrich August I. » Wed May 07, 2014 9:19 am

Hi Chema,

As far as I know at Nördlingen no Electorate Saxon Troops were involved
because they fought under von Arnim at the same time against the Imperials in Saxony under Wallenstein.

Sorry for being of no help to You.

Cheers,

Günter
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by j1mwallace » Wed May 07, 2014 9:45 am

The blue brigade participated in the battle. However they are not the Swedish Blues. They are German mercenary blues.
The Swedish yellow brigade participated.

The regiments of Bernard of Saxe Weimar were predominantly financed by the French.Information on flags for Bernard is pretty difficult to come by.
I'm pretty sure I have a copy of the personal standard which my pal used as an "army" standard.
The battle flag ones are pretty good.
As far as i know the Swedish flag at the time was the three crowns of the Vasa family. The swedish flag as we know it wasn't adopted until the turn of the 20th century.
No evidence one way or another for Hackapell cavalry so to be honest I would bung one in.For a bit of colour
cheers

In 25 years of gaming my Swedish old blues have never run away!!
chema1986
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by chema1986 » Wed May 07, 2014 11:23 am

Friedrich August I. wrote:Hi Chema,

As far as I know at Nördlingen no Electorate Saxon Troops were involved
because they fought under von Arnim at the same time against the Imperials in Saxony under Wallenstein.

Sorry for being of no help to You.

Cheers,

Günter
Hi Günther, thanks for your answer, I knew Saxony switched sides on 30 years war, but I thought some protestant troops remained with the Swedish under Bernard of Saxe-Weimar. which nationality had those germans fighting with Bernard and Horn ?? thanks ;)
Cheers,

Chema.
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by chema1986 » Wed May 07, 2014 11:29 am

j1mwallace wrote:The blue brigade participated in the battle. However they are not the Swedish Blues. They are German mercenary blues.
The Swedish yellow brigade participated.

The regiments of Bernard of Saxe Weimar were predominantly financed by the French.Information on flags for Bernard is pretty difficult to come by.
I'm pretty sure I have a copy of the personal standard which my pal used as an "army" standard.
The battle flag ones are pretty good.
As far as i know the Swedish flag at the time was the three crowns of the Vasa family. The swedish flag as we know it wasn't adopted until the turn of the 20th century.
No evidence one way or another for Hackapell cavalry so to be honest I would bung one in.For a bit of colour
cheers

In 25 years of gaming my Swedish old blues have never run away!!

Hello J1wallace, many thanks ! I was about to use the Swedish old blues flags with that regiment... but in order to be more historically accurate I may change it.
Yes, I have already painted my Yellow brigade and have order the battle flag's standards for that Saxe-weimar troops. Thanks again for your answers
p.d. what standard do your friend use ?

Cheers !

Chema
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by Friedrich August I. » Wed May 07, 2014 5:29 pm

Take the OOB from Nafziger as a hint what may have been available at Noerdlingen:

Bernhard von Sachsen-Weimars Army
http://usacac.army.mil/cac2/CGSC/CARL/n ... 634XAA.pdf

Horns Army
http://usacac.army.mil/cac2/CGSC/CARL/n ... 634XAB.pdf

Hope that helps,

Cheers,
Günter
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by Tacitus » Wed May 07, 2014 5:54 pm

j1mwallace wrote: As far as i know the Swedish flag at the time was the three crowns of the Vasa family. The swedish flag as we know it wasn't adopted until the turn of the 20th century.
The Swedish flag in the 17th century looked pretty much like it does now, and it probably has a medieval origin. However, during the union with Norway 1814-1905 a special union flag was used with a mix of the Swedish and Norwegian flag in the upper inner corner. In 1905 the clean Swedish flag was once again adopted but this time with lighter shades of blue and yellow.

The three crowns is not the symbol of the Vasa family. It was used as a symbol for Sweden as early as 1336 and might have been used already in the 13th century. The coat of arms for the Vasa dynasty is shown in the centre of this rendition of an older Swedish coat of arms:

Image

In any way the Swedish national flag would not be carried by army regiments until 1819. Even the provincial coat of arms were rarely used during the Thirty Years War. The colours had instead pretty generic 17th century motifs in that war.
chema1986
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by chema1986 » Wed May 07, 2014 7:54 pm

Thanks for that useful info ! I've already bought some more Swedish flags
Cheers,

Chema
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Re: Nördlingen 1634

Post by turrabear » Thu May 29, 2014 4:04 am

chema1986 wrote:
j1mwallace wrote:The blue brigade participated in the battle. However they are not the Swedish Blues. They are German mercenary blues.
The Swedish yellow brigade participated.

The regiments of Bernard of Saxe Weimar were predominantly financed by the French.Information on flags for Bernard is pretty difficult to come by.
I'm pretty sure I have a copy of the personal standard which my pal used as an "army" standard.
The battle flag ones are pretty good.
As far as i know the Swedish flag at the time was the three crowns of the Vasa family. The swedish flag as we know it wasn't adopted until the turn of the 20th century.
No evidence one way or another for Hackapell cavalry so to be honest I would bung one in.For a bit of colour
cheers

In 25 years of gaming my Swedish old blues have never run away!!

Hello J1wallace, many thanks ! I was about to use the Swedish old blues flags with that regiment... but in order to be more historically accurate I may change it.
Yes, I have already painted my Yellow brigade and have order the battle flag's standards for that Saxe-weimar troops. Thanks again for your answers
p.d. what standard do your friend use ?

Cheers !

Chema
the old blue regiment and the yellow regiment were actualy both german mercenary regiments . the regiment that fought at nordlingen may have been the new blue regiment. as the old blue regiment was destroyed at lutzen as for the old blue regiment flags they may have actually belonged to a swedish national regiment same with the green regiment flags . the old blue regiment flags may actualy have had yellow devices on there flags rather than the white devises which are normaly shown. justa word of advice when buying 30 years war flags a lot of the flags that are on sale are actualy fake . i could mention a well known wargames flag supplier who sell's 30 years war flags and a good part of his swedish collection is fake.
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