The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

OK, so after two years I've finally given in to having a section of the FORUM specifically set up to discuss painting techniques, display examples, show your latest projects and chat about this vital part of the hobby. Manufacturers please feel free to post up your sculpts, ask questions about what the gamers are after and generally promote your work.. no charge! Painters, please also feel free to post up your work for comment and critique. I can't promise the unreserved adulation characteristic of some other fora but I would hope you'd get constructive and measured comment!
Artimas
First Lieutenant
First Lieutenant
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 2:29 am
Location: Jefferson City, Missouri USA

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Artimas » Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:43 pm

Amazing as usual!!

Artimas
Jefferson City, Missouri USA
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Mon May 18, 2015 4:18 am

Dear Friends,

To break the long time silence here I want to say that I started to undo the Errors done by my last painter by re-painting those last 3 Regiments.
He thought they would have been Regiments of other Nations but not Saxon so he turned the colour scheme around and painted the coats in the colours of the cuffs :roll:

Three of the Regiments are based and three have to get a work over.

WIP Pictures later this week.

Cheers,

Günter
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Wed Jun 28, 2017 5:14 pm

I am still kickin' :lol:

To be honest the Saxon Flu never left me and so I followed with great envy the exploits of all those Saxon raising Forum members.

As there are (still) about 7 Saxon Foot Regiments of my First Army unfinished - not correct :roll: painted and only half of them based - I noticed that, for what Reason ever, Master Clarence made one Saxon Flag in the wrong colour! :?

No big deal but for the FPABC's it's a real NoGo! :D

Just for those who are curious... Wustromirsky should have been of a Dark Grey and not Dark Green Colour. I cross checked with mine and Dan's notes and it stays at Dark Grey. So you may also use the DROSTE, BEICHLINGEN or WEIMAR Colours as they are of a Neutral Grey.

One more thing about the Flags;
They have been issued between 1702 and 1704 and in parts been used until the surrender in 1706.
In 1706 the King/Elector gave order for new flags for the Army. But as the Swedes occupied Saxony the Manufacturer kept them stowed away from those filthy :twisted: Norsemens and so the 1706 Pattern were issued as soon as the Swedes began their "Russian Sight Seeing Tour" :wink:
Last edited by Friedrich August I. on Sun Jul 09, 2017 11:09 am, edited 2 times in total.
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
barr7430
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 5851
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 4:22 pm
Location: EK,Scotland
Contact:

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by barr7430 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:14 pm

thanks Gunter.. mistaking grey for green.. I have seen these minor errors 'go down in history' and set the standard for misinterpretation - Danish uniforms in Ireland for example.. so Clarence is turning into a revisionist historian.. or is it all just fake news?
"If you think you can, or if you think you can't, you are probably right"

Henry Ford
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:03 pm

barr7430 wrote:thanks Gunter.. mistaking grey for green.. I have seen these minor errors 'go down in history' and set the standard for misinterpretation - Danish uniforms in Ireland for example.. so Clarence is turning into a revisionist historian.. or is it all just fake news?
Well, could have happened in those damp cold winternights over there in Virginia :wink: :D that his eyes played him a trick.
Back in 2013 I sent him a list with Valejo colour codes so he could easely match the Flags with Colours I would use for Colars and Cuffs.
Wustromirsky(23) Dark Grey Facing colors Pewter Buttons therefore Valejo 70994 Dark Grey

As I said before no big deal :wink:
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Mon Jul 03, 2017 4:20 pm

Here is a sample how the 1706 created but not before 1707/1708 issued flags would have looked like:
20170629_064917.jpg
20170629_064917.jpg (32.55 KiB) Viewed 3248 times
Last edited by Friedrich August I. on Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:31 am

Let us take a short look on the Saxon Army after Fraustadt 1706.
All that was left of the Soldiers on Foot at the time of the invasion by Sweden was about 2-3000 men and about 2-3000 survivors who were dripping into Saxony from Poland. The Cavalry returned from Poland mostly intact at the end of 1708 with King August.
Von der Schulenburg, after the departure of the last Swedish contingent, did his utmost to build up the Saxon units. More then half of the former Regiments were disbanded because of the lack of men.
1709 saw 10 Regiments of Foot formed again in various strenght. Approx. 600-700men formed a Battalion, 2 Battalions a Regiment.
For some time even the Saxon-Polish Guard were formed into one "Doppel-Regiment" of 4 Battalions. When August II. met Czar Peter in East Poland to discuss the further strategies for the war Peter presented August with a "gift" of serveral thousand Saxon Prisoners of War. A number of them joined the Ranks again while many others were sent home.
From 1709 until 1713 the Saxons formed a support corps of about 8000 men in the Service of the Maritime Powers consisting of 10 Battalions and 2 Cavalry Regiments. To bring those Battalions to full strenght several others gave up personal to fill the ranks. 1713 the last Saxon Troops returned home.
For this period of the GNW and WSS the new Flags can be used. Within the next weeks Barry, Clarence and me will discuss terms of production and making them available to you all.
Last edited by Friedrich August I. on Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:33 am

It took me a while to write those Regiments together that were actually in existence in 1706-07 but here they are:

Infantry:
(Polnische) Garde (2) for some time the Garde formed the "Doppel-Regiment" (4)
(Deutsche) Garde (2)
Kurprinz (2)
Königin (2)
Venediger (2) broken up 1707 incorporated into Weissenfels
Fürstenberg (2)
Wackerbarth (2)
O'Gilvy (2)
Weissenfels (2)
Seckendorf (2)
Seissan(Flemming?) (2)
Garrison of Dresden (2 until 1710 when raised to 4)

Cavalry Cuirassiers
Garde du Corps (4)
Chevalier Garde (1)
Leib-Regiment (4)
Kurprinz (4)
Damitz (4)
Königin (4)
Eichstädt (4)
Beust (4)
a.d. Winckel (4)
Prinz Alexander (4)

Cavalry Dragoner
Leib-Regiment (4)
Milkau (4)
Goltz (4)
Brause (4)
Schulenburg (4)
Brandenburg-Bayreuth (4)
Dünewald (4)
Wrangel (4)

The attempted strenght of Troops sent to the Maritime Powers have been 8000 men in 10 Battalions, 2 Regiments Cuirassiers and 1 Regiment Dragoons. Each Foot Battalion had 2 guns attached according to some sources.
Last edited by Friedrich August I. on Mon Jul 10, 2017 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:51 am

Because a certain Prussian King had BURNED most of the Flags that had been stored in the Dresden Arsenal no flags (of the time before 1756) existed when E. Hottenroth examined the Flags and wrote his book about the Saxon Flags and Standards.
The most trustworthy source for his research had been the handwritings and drawing by the hand of the Elector/King himself to shed light on the GNW times and the flags carried by the troops.

This is the reason why there is a small controverse about a certain element on the so-called 1706 Flag type. Here are the two different positions:
Flags 1706.jpg
First the more sensible type - Red field behind the Polish Eagle and Lithuanian Knight
Flags 1706.jpg (46.8 KiB) Viewed 3248 times
Here the other version
20170629_064917.jpg
20170629_064917.jpg (32.55 KiB) Viewed 3248 times

In Terms of Beauty the 2nd Version would be my choice but by Historical Terms... the Polish White Eagle has allways been on a Red Field.
Proof = look at the Guard Colours!
Last edited by Friedrich August I. on Sun Jul 09, 2017 11:10 am, edited 3 times in total.
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Sat Jul 08, 2017 6:25 am

Dragoner Standards, as described by Hottenroth, only changed in size, but like most Horse Regiments, didnt change their former appearance:
Dragoner Standarten.jpg
Dragoner Standarten.jpg (27.55 KiB) Viewed 3248 times
As the Cuirassiers received 1708 new Standards the type would have changed to chime in with the others - White Eagle inside, Lithuanian Knight on the outside. Squared format.
Dragoner Standards were reduced in size, renewed in 1709, with above appearances.
Last edited by Friedrich August I. on Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
obriendavid
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2557
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 3:41 pm
Location: Scotland
Contact:

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by obriendavid » Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:00 pm

Gunter for some reason your photos aren't showing up?

It says to update your Photobucket account but I'm already logged in and updated so perhaps it means you? I know a number of people have been having problems with Photobucket and even when I was checking my account I was getting bombarded by adverts as soon as I tried to do anything.

Dave
User avatar
obriendavid
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2557
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 3:41 pm
Location: Scotland
Contact:

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by obriendavid » Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:07 pm

The problem seems to be with 3rd party hosting, they now want you to pay $39.99 a month so that people can see your photos. I can see a lot of people no longer using Photobucket.

Dave
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Sat Jul 08, 2017 2:05 pm

obriendavid wrote:The problem seems to be with 3rd party hosting, they now want you to pay $39.99 a month so that people can see your photos. I can see a lot of people no longer using Photobucket.

Dave
Well, Thanks Dave, for telling me that. I first thought it was only a addblocker I used but now I believe it is actually time to switch to a different site...means moving about 2k picks...DAMM!
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
User avatar
Friedrich August I.
General of the Army
General of the Army
Posts: 2108
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 4:23 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by Friedrich August I. » Sat Jul 08, 2017 7:27 pm

It took me 5 hours to clean up my Photobucket account.
Now I have to seek out a new place were I can put those almost 2k pictures AND be able to link them here..
„Macht Euch Euren Dregg alleene“

"Sort your filth out by yourself!" The King of Saxony Friedrich August III., at his abdication 1918, referred to the quarrels in the parliament and the squabbling within the provisional government.
RogerC
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 271
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2016 7:26 pm
Location: Bradford UK
Contact:

Re: The raising of the Saxon Army 1699-1712

Post by RogerC » Sun Jul 09, 2017 10:33 am

Try Flickr, I had same problem and had to move all mine.

Love those flags by the way, shame I already have the earlier ones.
Post Reply