Pursuit after Cavalry melee

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ian-Aberd
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Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by ian-Aberd » Fri May 30, 2014 9:05 am

The aftermath of a cavalry melee still confuses me!

Let us say that a regiment of Ironsides has just defeated a regiment of Cavaliers - they have suffered one casualty and rout.
There is a second regiment of Royalist horse 4 inches directly behind them.

The Cavaliers roll 8 for their rout move.
I think they pass straight through the regiment behind them (interpenetrating or lapping round) rather than stopping when they hit them.

The Ironsides roll 9 for their pursuit move.
In normal circumstances they would catch the fleeing Cavaliers, but now there is a second regiment in the way.
Do they plough into them?
Do they have to pass another morale test to contact the new target?
Do they get a charge bonus?
Does the new target have any options (fire, countercharge etc) or do they simply receive the charge at the halt? Do they take a morale test?

Any guidance on how to play this out would be very welcome.
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flick40
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Re: Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by flick40 » Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:58 pm

Hi,

How you play this is going to come down to your and your opponents experience. The rules are simple, fast-play and unfortunately not written for detail on every situation. There are many ways you could play this out and this would be a very long post if I tried to go over each one. Here's a couple.

First, as long as the routers have enough movement they are going to go around (or over) terrain or friendly units.

The easiest is that they pass their morale and have the choice to not pursue. Seeing a fresh enemy it could be wise to sit tight and hope your card comes up again before your opponents.

As soon as the routers are gone you new see the new enemy and instead of testing for pursuit you test to charge the new target (unless the enemy are shaken in which case there is no test). They can elect to counter charge and test as well. Then follow the procedure for charges/melee. Remembering that they are disordered due to the previous melee and should suffer the -2 (horse after the first bound of combat) in melee. This is what makes the first option appealing. You still count the charging bonus for this new target.

Try to keep the answer simple and agreeable and don't get bogged down. Remember it's a game, win some, lose some.

Joe
"Is that your opinion or the game masters ruling?"
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quindia
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Re: Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by quindia » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:21 pm

What he said!

Thanks, Joe...
ian-Aberd
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Re: Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by ian-Aberd » Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:30 pm

Joe, thanks for your interesting reply. While what you say is sensible advice, personally I do think that the rules should spell out what happens in the situation I have described.
Stating the obvious, pursuit after Cavalry melee isn't really a rare or unusual event in the War of the Three Kingdoms.
Perhaps Trotters or Cuirassiers would not pile into the unit behind, but maybe Gallopers would (or would attempt to)?
I don't think what happens should be based on a gentlemanly agreement on the night - a paragraph or two of clarification in the rules would surely suffice.
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Re: Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by flick40 » Fri Jun 20, 2014 10:44 pm

I'm not sure where the argument lies or you missed my point. These rules are years old so I wouldn't expect an update anytime soon but they are popular in certain circles. Unfortunately the rules are vague on this point. I gave my solution and the rules author agreed. You are free to add a written addition to your copy of the rules and use them. In the end your opponent will have input and your errata will be based on your in house discussion. As long as you are having fun that's all that matters.

Joe
Last edited by flick40 on Sat Jun 21, 2014 4:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by quindia » Sat Jun 21, 2014 3:19 am

Ian,

The rules are obviously incomplete (it even says so on the first page)... that's one of the reasons they are still free! The doc you have hasn't been updated since 2005(?) or so. I have every intention of giving them the League of Augsburg treatment for full publication, but other projects have kept me from returning to the book.

I appreciate it might be frustrating to be in the middle of a game and find the answer to a rule question missing, but to be honest I usually DO adjudicate such things on the fly. I rarely play competitively so a gentleman's agreement usually suffices. Certainly when (if) I ever get around to finishing VWQ it will be complete, but until then you may find the need to expand on what's written.

At the same time I welcome questions because things like this are bound to be taken into consideration when I do get around to polishing this up!

Also, Joe is probably one of the few people who has played these rules more than I have (and probably more recently) and you may usually trust his advice on them...
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Re: Pursuit after Cavalry melee

Post by ian-Aberd » Sat Jun 21, 2014 8:34 am

No, I am not making an argument - I am accepting what has been said.
The rules are vague on what happens in the situation I have described.
So the group I belong to will have to come up with a house rule to cover what happens.

This is not a criticism of "VwQ". Who could complain about a free set of rules that has provided so many enjoyable battles over the years?

One day it would be nice to buy an expanded version, but I appreciate that may be some years away! Hopefully annoying questions from gamers like me may assist in the preparation of a later edition.

For now my group will devise a house rule to cover pursuing cavalry being confronted by a new enemy unit. Joe's suggestions will be our starting point.

Off the top of my head I would propose:

1) Trotters will stop 3" away from the new unit, but have the option to charge into shaken cavalry if they pass a discipline test (a morale roll).

2) Gallopers must charge into shaken horse, they will charge into steady horse or shaken foot if they fail a discipline test. Otherwise they stop 3" away.

I am sure that these proposals will get modified after discussion.
I will post the house rule here if we can come up with something succinct that produces realistic outcomes.
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